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As far as the part-time job he quit last night ( did I mention that?). He says he still needs to tie up some things so he’ll still go in the office. He asked not to get paid but the boss/his drinking buddy said they weren’t allowed to do that but they’d pay minimum wage instead. Unbelievable. All to screw me. And I was friends with the boss.

Yeah, be careful. There are some very special people that do whatever it takes to avoid fulfilling financial obligations to the family they ultimately decide to screw over. Not to mention trying to humiliate you by listing all your deeds to your kids? This guy's the very definition of an entitled, vindictive POS.

It is difficult to take money out of a joint account. Since the bank already seem to know you are seperating you need to inform them that it will be a divorce hence that money cannot be touched and you both should be entitled to have half. I no longer have a savings account with my H. We have a joint account where all our bills go from. I would never open a savings account with him again. Luckily I did manage to move all the money as he was the second account holder and I was the first. It did take a long time and several bank managers to approve it. Im just grateful they didnt contact him at the time. He did later find out. Was he angry? Im sure he was. He didnt lash out. He just knew things between us were getting serious and I was not messing about.
My advice would be to tell the bank that half the money is yours in the account and that bank account needs to be frozen until divorce is finalised. So then that will be the time your monies is released. If He gets angry let him. If he is verbally or physically abusing you call the police. Do not allow him to get aggressive towards you. You will not be his punching bag. Get a restraining order against him. You need to do everything you can to protect yourself from him. Your mental health is just as important! You will no longer let him make you feel weak and vulnerable. You are strong and you will continue to be strong for yourself and your children!

I may have to pay him spousal support, especially since he just quit his job. Pathetic is word that keeps coming to mind.

He’s sleeping on the couch, he usually did anyway because he’d always fall asleep with some violent show on tv. I’m happy imagining a future home with no tv and some silence. He always has the tv on. Anyway now there is room for all three entitled dogs on the bed.

I drove my son two hours to camp someplace 45 miles away and he excitedly talked the whole time, he is looking forward to school starting, getting his license, applying for college.He’s a smart kid but would rather use his computer for gaming than homework. My WH always threatens that we aren’t going to pay tuition if he doesn’t put in more effort ( not unreasonable but now it’s his senior year and should stop). WH also doesn’t want to pay for college unless he raises his gpa. At least now with a divorce I can put hs and college tuition in an agreement. DS skipped off to see his friends tonight, a huge improvement from yesterday.

DD still doesn’t want to talk to either of us but had fun with company that was over last night.

Company? Oh yes, this is mi vida loca. We host foreign LEO families and we were expecting one from Spain with teens. WH told both kids they were on the hook to entertain kids. I know he hoped I’d hang out and interpret. I told DS not to worry I’d still take him camping and DD to go with her friends. When I got home from work DS was having a ball with the teens, adults were elsewhere. DD got home from friends and adored the teen girl, also 18.

I had a glass of wine and discussed Spanish politics until 1 am, tried to keep WH in the loop but it was tough. I made an immediate friend with the wife. Odd how extreme emotions can pop out now. I didn’t tell her about the divorce but we discussed similar problems with our girls, maybe that’s why they got along so well too.

So it was a pretty night, we all were on the deck where you can see mountains and the city, we sang along to old Spanish pop songs and promised to meet again. WH seemed grateful.

But as much as I love entertaining in this house , as much as I loved seeing everyone happy together, I am still done. I can’t wait to have my own quiet place, my own finances, not have to get between my WH and DS fighting, not have to wake up to snoring and zombie apocalypse at 2 am.

I don’t know if I can swing buying a house before we sell this one but I’m hoping!! I know legal ramifications need to be ironed out. And for the person with the bank info, thank you so much. I read and re-read everyone’s comments. The support I feel from you is incredibly helpful.

LILA you message must have come when I was writing mine. Great advice. I wish I would have separated everything 10 yrs ago after the first DDay.

Maybe speak to the attorney about the spousal support. I'm not sure it will be an issue. In my situation, I had just started a full-time job after neither my spouse or I had worked in 10 years. WH had a few side projects and volunteer work. (Funny how that gives them plentyof time to start a new relationship.) I was told my husband would be evaluated based on his employment potential and history. We had owned a successful business and worked together. WH has a PhD in engineering, and we had the same basic work experience.

I've also heard that judges look unfavorably on people trying to play clever games like suddenly getting a minimum wage job immediately preceding a divorce. That may backfire on your STBX.

It may backfire, it sounds fraudulent of the company to change his pay to minimum wage.

Judges do not like to see people "under employed"

Sooooo his plan may backfire on him. If he earned $75,000 last year but only earned $25.000 this year, it is possible the judge will assume he can earn $75k annually and use that as a basis for his earnings for alimony and child support.

He’s not fooling anyone if that is what he’s trying to do.

Judges and lawyers and mediators know all the games people play.

Droppedshoe I was faced with not just the possibility of spousal support but child support as well. This was after the economic collapse in 07.
My husband lost his 6 figure income to being unemployed ironically it was also allowed me to finally get proof.

But in your situation where he intentionally lost income I would think that would be frowned upon.

I would not suggest going the mediation route without at least having an attorney go over your case. You risk much by trusting a crazy ex. Who knows what he's hiding, and him taking lower pay right at filing is sure to bring up red flags in the case. That's a risk not worth as least covering with an attorney. Make sure you have all the statements for the bank and retirement going back years to see if he's been hiding or taking money out without you knowing.

As for the kids, thats really crummy for him to do, but you just need to fight it with the truth. He cheated 10 yrs ago, let the kids and family know why you're out now. Name the AP so that he can't just bring her around in 3 months and pretend like they connected after the D. Get the truth out.

Thank you. I have an attorney in case the mediator falls through. I thought my bank would wire money to the mediator today so we could start but they didn’t. I have to go see why not. Despite what the suspicious guy at the bank said my # was already on the account as a secondary cell so they could have called me for approval to transfer. I am beyond frustrated.

He’s playing the victim now; saying he wasn’t cheating. Although he erased the text where he asked a woman out to a bar I know about when it happened ( I was sitting next to him at the "cool bar" he wanted to meet her at) so I did look at the cell phone bill to see her number and to see how many other times he called ( he says five but they were all innocent). There’s about 12 texts during the time period so I told him what I was doing and asked what number was hers.

He said he didn’t know because he erased her contact info and why did I care anyway since I am leaving anyway. True but I had his victim attitude.

I would like to move out but a year of rent will cut into my ability to get a down payment on a house. I asked if he would allow me to get half our cash and take a loan on my retirement and quitclaim a house to me.

He says he can’t trust me because I threatened to " get him." Delusional. I did say he’d be sorry because he’ll end up lonely.

I hate this. I wish he’d just move out of this house and let me stay until our son graduates. I was doing really well being indifferent towards him but hate is welling up.

I meant to say above I hate his victim attitude!! Not had

Don't go to mediation. I can't say that loudly or emphatically enough. Mediation is a settlement conference, with a referee. It only works if both parties are honest and honorable or, in the alternative, if both parties are more or less equally dishonest and cutthroat.

Listen to your lawyer's advice. It comes from years of hard-won experience. For example, in a trial, you can often impute income to your WH, even if he is not earning any because of voluntarily leaving a job. This stuff impacts you for life.

Often, we make the mistake of thinking NOW is the FUTURE.
If he has a pattern of earing income then a temporary set-back won’t really change much regarding spousal support and all that. After all – if all you needed to do was not earn an income for some months and that would guarantee you eternal spousal support EVERY person divorcing would quit their jobs.

Right NOW you are going through turbulent times and you shouldn’t base your FUTURE on them. Get this over with and THEN see what cards you have to play with.

Here are some suggestions:
Remove the drama as much as you can.
It doesn’t really matter why you are divorcing him. You don’t "win" divorce nor do you need to prove to him, his family, friends or your family that he cheated. You aren’t really divorcing him because he cheated – rather you are divorcing him because you can’t envision remaining married to him.
I’m not advocating hiding his affair, but in the argument whether he cheated or not you can be just as divorced if he thinks he "won" that argument. You can definitely tell stakeholders that you don’t want to remain married because – amongst other things – he has repeatedly broken your trust/cheated, but you do NOT have to convince each and every one. It’s enough that YOU believe.

Do NOT take money out of retirement! It’s fined, taxed and will be the most expensive loan you have ever taken. Don’t worry NOW about that rental agreement and all that – these are all issues that are dealt with in the divorce process.

This might sound sad but it’s probably true… Chances are that there is nothing unique about your divorce. The professional mediator has seen it all before, and/or has access to case-files and precedents for anything you or he throws at them. Like spousal support? If he is due some then its because there are legal examples.

The mediator costs. An attorney costs. It would be a major mistake to pay someone for advice and work and then not listen to them. If your attorney tells you something isn’t worth pursuing – listen. Basically the main question you ask the mediator is if something is legally required or is a choice – a decision. Allow the professionals to deal with the details while you focus on moving on with your life.

Excellent points. As far as " proving cheating" I guess I am remembering the first time, the same victim mentality, TT, until I found all the evidence. Last time only once I found everything did he break down and apologize. But this time isn’t last time. I’m not going to reconcile and it’s enough that he is behaving the way he is.

My retirement allows me to take a loan and pay the interest back to myself. A deal and a half! My concern with moving is getting him to move and sell the house.

The mediator is on the advice of the attorney, and even though he doesn’t have any money yet he’s already preparing dissolution paperwork and answering our questions.

If I found proof would he run with his tail between his legs and roll over on the house? ( I’d like to stay until DS graduates in June, then sell). Probably not. Would his family pressure him and would that work? Again, probably not. I’d like this to already be over.

I get that you were the BS and are hurting, but did you stop to consider that telling the kids the reason why you two are divorcing was more about getting back at him than about being up front with them? Just saying…telling them that only places unnecessary (and unfair) burden on them. They don’t need to know the details, they just need to know that you two are having issues.
Perhaps reconsider putting them in the middle. Don’t worry about what he does. You be the bigger person and set the right example.

Shoe, please take half of YOUR money and put it in another account at another bank. Do this tomorrow. You are at his mercy right now, and evidently the banks as well, and there’s no reason for it.

All I do is think of the kids. They are 18 and just shy of 17. I kept the first affair from them, Leo all fighting from them when they were little. I told them " we are divorcing because of an affair. I am sorry but I can’t continue to live with your father." They are old enough to know that. My WH is telling everyone I am splitting up our family. My kids should know. Maybe your shouldn’t. Maybe little kids shouldn’t and certainly they don’t need to know details but the do need to know 1) that if they are ever in an unhealthy relationship they should leave and 2) that I do not take our family bond lightly.

DroppedShoe

Here is the guidance I received from my very expensive and fabulous therapist. At the time that my husband was going through his affair our divorce was happening very quickly. My husband was adamant that he no longer wanted to be married and he wanted to divorce about 10 days after he told me of the affair.

When I spoke with my therapist he informed me that I need to be honest with my children about why the divorce was occurring. I pushed back on that because I felt that they did not need to know about our marriage issues. The therapist explained to me that if I don’t tell them the truth they are going to think that I am the one that wants the divorce and they will blame me, which would be unfair.

I don’t think you did anything wrong in the manner in which you told your children because it was a statement of fact without emotion. It’s unfortunate that your husband chose to retaliate and tell your children the things that you did, and drag them into the middle of this situation.

You are a role model for your children. They will need to see that under certain circumstances it is just now possible to continue a relationship and sometimes your only option is the hard choice that you are being forced to make.

Please hang in there. You are doing your best and looking out for your family to the best of your ability. I know it seems hard right now but in the long run I know things will improve for you.

[This message edited by The1stWife at 1:22 PM, Wednesday, August 17th]

Thank you, that helps more than you know. I negotiate for a living (attorney). After decades of doing this I have learned that there is no substitute for caring about my clients, putting in the work and being honest. I thought of this when thinking of how to approach the kids. My WH is being sneaky, manipulative and vengeful. After years of being absent ( worked a swing shift by choice) he’s quickly trying to win them over; took them to an amusement park by himself for the first time ever. Truth for it’s own sake, not for revenge, should be told.

100%, The1stwife. Dropped, your kids are young adults and they will resent the truth being withheld from them. It is already stressful for the kids that their lives are being blown up and it is completely out of their control. The truth, without editorialization, is critical for your relationship with your kids.

You do not have to defend yourself, you did the right thing. You can let them know the truth about their reality without dragging them through the mud with you and your husband. Do not speak ill of their dad to them, they will be able to witness it with their own eyes.

Keep listening to yourself because you can trust your own judgement and your instincts are spot on. Even if the kids are upset with you now, keep being consistent and coming through when they need you. Be the sane parent every day all the time, and even if they do not see it immediately, they will absolutely see it over time. Do not take your STBXH's bait; he will try to make you look bad to the kids by goading you into fights or reactions. He will try to push your buttons. See it for what it is and keep your eyes on your goal. Look up gray rock if you are unfamiliar with the term. You need to be a gray rock to your STBWXH.

You are better than the Jerry Springer show your STBWXH is turning your life into. This too will pass.

Edit: last sentence was cut off

[This message edited by BigMammaJamma at 4:52 PM, Wednesday, August 17th]