SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

My wife’s infidelity caused an upheaval that shook the foundations of our marriage. (I know I am preaching to the choir here at SI.) In the years, prior to D-day, I thought, by the grace of God, fortified by our love and commitment to each other, that all the structures of our life and union were solid and would weather any calamity. D-day 2, round 2, well, that crumbled everything into an enormous pile of unrecognizable rubble.

34 years ago, I could not separate the nonsalvageable from the salvageable.

Was she, was I, were we, was anything redeemable? For what was once hallow was now hollow.

While sorting through what had been razed by adultery, I made countless mistakes. (Still do, which is how I ended up seeking out SI a year ago June.) Probably the greatest error was I could no longer see anything as ever being what I thought it was. Everything must have been a lie! With that new operating thought, or I believe more accurately said, self-lie, taking control I began to accumulate and hoard all the chaos into a singular cluster of debris. That blunder led me to view everything as unreal, untrue, un-good which led to me trying to solve every issue, hurt, anger, disappointment, fear, disgust, doubts, and so much more, simultaneously.

Over time it became clear to me that I needed to rethink, regroup, reprioritize, if I hoped to find my way out of the disorienting void that I was staggering my way through.

For me, and please understand, I am not attempting to speak for all those who have been betrayed, but for "me" to survive and recover, I needed to shelve some issues (some temporary, some permanently) while working on others. To priorities, divide, and set aside, is not the same as to rug-sweep or avoidant behavior.

I also realized I needed to work on what went wrong by employing patience with myself and my wife, not by making fixed demands on either of us. To temporarily put one’s own needs aside is not weak, it takes strength, an enormous amount of strength.

As information began to flow, in spits and spurts, I realized that as painful and unfair as it was, trickle truth is how humans tend to reveal the worst of their behaviors. I believe expecting/demanding complete and immediate disclosure is asking for more than what most individuals can do. Asking for it is reasonable and a wayward would-be kind and wise to supply it. However, I contend that demanding immediate and full truth is every bit of a set up for failure as trickle truth is.

Then there is the setting of boundaries. Yes, boundaries are extremely important in all relationships. But every boundary is a wall. Do I make it solid, unenterable, or do I build windows and doors into it? That is not co-dependent. It is chosen vulnerability.

One decision that I have never regretted was not to become a detective or warden. I was committed to the idea of not allowing my wife’s actions to develop in me a personality that I did not want - a suspicious nature compounded by controlling behaviors.

I am not suggesting anyone go about the hard work of finding one’s way through the anarchy brought about by infidelity the way I did. I am sure not suggesting that I am a success story to emulate. I am only making a statement that there are many paths to healing, many ways to reconcile with oneself, and, if desired, with one’s partner, or to choose divorce if that is the chosen course of action.

Asterisk

For most betrayeds, if they want to know the full extent of the affair, often have to resort to being their own investigator.

I think that often the betrayed gets a watered down version of the affair(s). For some, that’s enough. For others, they need details and then some.

Case in point. The OW told me how my H had a business trip but returned a few days early to spend those days (and nights) w/ her. I’m sure he wasn’t going to admit to that as I wasn’t asking for the days and times they met in person.

However I’m glad I was told. That detail changed things for me and recognized the depths my H would go to have an affair.

Everyone is different and once you know or see something, you can’t erase it. It’s often said it’s hard to R (and forgive) if you don’t have all the facts/details. I think it varies by person as to how much intel you need.

For me, and please understand, I am not attempting to speak for all those who have been betrayed, but for "me" to survive and recover, I needed to shelve some issues (some temporary, some permanently) while working on others. To priorities, divide, and set aside, is not the same as to rug-sweep or avoidant behavior.

Sounds familiar. I went through a similar process. For me, it was like an overflowing inbox of shit to process. I could hardly work on one at a time. Trying to work on it all wasn't going to happen. Some of those issues never got resolved, either because they didn't seem particularly pressing or eventually became irrelevant.

To temporarily put one’s own needs aside is not weak, it takes strength, an enormous amount of strength.

I agree it's strength when it's done as a conscious choice.

Musing here: I wonder if it's strength when done out of co-dependence, too. Perhaps life takes strength whenever one delays a reward.

As information began to flow, in spits and spurts, I realized that as painful and unfair as it was, trickle truth is how humans tend to reveal the worst of their behaviors. I believe expecting/demanding complete and immediate disclosure is asking for more than what most individuals can do. Asking for it is reasonable and a wayward would-be kind and wise to supply it. However, I contend that demanding immediate and full truth is every bit of a set up for failure as trickle truth is.

Yeah. One of the things that turned me off a couple of web forums so long ago was the insistence on giving a WS one chance to write down everything about the A. Memory doesn't work like that for me, and it doesn't work like that for anyone I know. That's why people take notes when doing research, and an A is not research. And if my W was honest in telling me she wanted to R, telling her she had one chance to write it all down would have doomed the effort from the start.

For some time (a few years?) I thought I got more info by telling my W, 'If I hear it now, I may walk. If I learn it months down the road, I will walk.' At some point, though, I realized the critical factor was that she resolved to tell the truth on d-day. As much as she didn't want to split, the demand for truth didn't have much effect.

Then there is the setting of boundaries. Yes, boundaries are extremely important in all relationships. But every boundary is a wall. Do I make it solid, unenterable, or do I build windows and doors into it? That is not co-dependent. It is chosen vulnerability.

A couple of thoughts....

First, a boundary can change as one's viewpoint changes. I

know

that my W closed a lot of vulnerabilities to further betrayal in her healing. If she cheated again 10 years later, it would have come from a vulnerability that hadn't been noticed, because she would have closed it if she had realized it was there. So would I have D'ed her? I don't know.

And then there's Jephthah....

One decision that I have never regretted was not to become a detective or warden. I was committed to the idea of not allowing my wife’s actions to develop in me a personality that I did not want - a suspicious nature compounded by controlling behaviors.

Being true to oneself. Admirable.

I am not suggesting anyone go about the hard work of finding one’s way through the anarchy brought about by infidelity the way I did. I am sure not suggesting that I am a success story to emulate. I am only making a statement that there are many paths to healing, many ways to reconcile with oneself, and, if desired, with one’s partner, or to choose divorce if that is the chosen course of action.

I'll disagree with this. Not acting reflexively, considering options, taking responsibility for oneself, making one's own choices in the here and now, acting humanely - I can imagine easier ways, but I can't imagine a better way.

Without knowing everything you don't know who you are married to. By knowing everything you have the necessary information to decide if this is someone you want to be with

After 27 years with someone you would assume you know them, but in my case this is obviously incorrect

And now I know that my wife is capable of something I never thought possible so now I'm trying to decide if she is someone I want to spend the rest of my life with

The 1st Wife

Agreed, details are important ( I did not mean to emply that they weren’t), The need for every unseemly scrap seemed extremely important to me in the first decade or so after D-day. And, as you stated, unfortunately, one cannot unsee once those finer, sordid details are revealed. Nor can one easily un-hurt from the imagery of them, or at least I cannot when I chose to relive them.

For me, decades post affair, the details are far less important than what my wife was internally struggling with and silently existing under the weight of. That heavy burden carried with it an unhappiness I was not aware of or feeling. She was deeply alone, married to a man she respected and liked but was never sextually attracted to or physically passionate about. I was a nice guy, good husband and kind father, who didn’t drink, do drugs, curse, or raised my hand or voice. However, in a twist of strangeness, those qualities only served to make her feel more stuck. She had no excuse to devoice me. She was mired and slowly, relentlessly sinking.

She made a youthful, teenage mistake in marrying me, that she had no avenue to correct. Now, she did have choices, and she should have devoiced me, but our religious beliefs denied her those choices so for her, and for me as well, that choice did not exist. It is important to note that that was then, and it is not our relationship now. Also, we both recognize, now that we are unburdened by faith, that we have choices and we have chosen to live out our lives together and have worked hard to create the passion we now share.

None of the above excuses her decision to cheat. I must be clear on that point. It only partially lays out the landscape that led up to her choices.

Thank you for sharing your thoughts.

Asterisk

Unhinged, my friend,

Some of those issues never got resolved, either because they didn't seem particularly pressing or eventually became irrelevant.

I think you nailed it with the word "irrelevant".

I think we both would agree that in the beginning of dealing with the "shit storm" that nothing is "irrelevant". But, from a long-hauler perspective, much of what I thought was extremely important to know and understand, has become unimportant.

What I do struggle with is my fallacy in thinking that if I did know everything, then I would understand everything and then and only then, I’d find peace from everything that occurred during the affair. Coming here, listening to advice from individuals like yourself has assisted me in recognizing the errors of my process. The collective wisdom here has assisted me in realizing that I will never know, all the facts, and, more importantly, I will probably never believe every fact given. Knowing that has helped me to seek my peace through different avenues.

Asterisk

Sisson,

Musing here: I wonder if it's strength when done out of co-dependence, too. Perhaps life takes strength whenever one delays a reward.

That is a very important distinction/clarification to muse over. One thing that stands out here at SI, is the strength of those on either side of the equation.

And then there's Jephthah....

Um, in the case of "Jephthah" I would hope I’d choose not to be true to myself. 😊 Kidding aside, thank you for your kind words.

Actually, you’re bringing up Jephthah, has supported something I said in my reply to The 1st Wife.

Jephthah made a vow that came to bite him in a way he had not imagine it would. He now was facing a predicament – he believed he had no choice but to fulfill his vow. So, he did the unimaginable. Others, in his time, would have probably been shocked and be in full puzzlement as to why he did not see that he had other, better choices. His situation is not unlike that of my wife and I. We made a vow that blinded both of us to the actual choices that others could clearly see. My wife did not divorce me because I had done nothing to give her the biblical excuse needed and I didn’t because of the biblical command to forgive. We were both blinded by our faith. I maintain that people do not have a choice when they are self-blinded, or blinded by other factors outside of themselves.

Asterisk

WB1340,

And now I know that my wife is capable of something I never thought possible so now I'm trying to decide if she is someone I want to spend the rest of my life with

You are facing an extremely difficult knowledge and decision, two that many of us have faced. I sure do not possess the wisdom to advise. I can only share my choices, some good, some bad.

One of the problems with what I write is that my words and thoughts are from 34 years post D-day and are not helpful or applicable to those who are early in the process. I often think I do more harm than good and puzzle over should I just keep my mouth shut.

And yet, having thoughts given by those who are further removed from the terrible pain of infidelity might give hope in what, in the early years, feels hopeless. I honestly do not know the truth here.

I am so deeply sorry you are facing the knowledge that your wife is capable of infidelity. I know that pain and the perplexity it creates.

Lastly, I would like to respond to:

By knowing everything you have the necessary information to decide if this is someone you want to be with

I am not saying this is true for you or anyone else, but for me, as the years and decades passed, I had concluded that I will never know everything. That fact was killing me from the inside out.

Though I didn’t realize it, it was no longer what my wife did that was hurting me, it was me hurting me by demanding that I know everything, which was an impossibility. Then add on top of that, would I believe everything that I now knew? And, to my dismay, I was blaming my wife for what I was now doing.

What some others here helped me to understand is that my relentless digging was keeping the distant past alive. The truth of the matter is that the truth of the past is no longer the truth of the moment I live in now. But, as I stated earlier, I don’t think my thoughts and struggles that I deal with these days are helpful to those, like yourself, who are in the shorter shadow cast by their more current D-day.

Asterisk

...the truth of the past is no longer the truth of the moment...

Very true.

Asterisk

I am not saying this is true for you or anyone else, but for me, as the years and decades passed, I had concluded that I will never know everything. That fact was killing me from the inside out.

Though I didn’t realize it, it was no longer what my wife did that was hurting me, it was me hurting me by demanding that I know everything, which was an impossibility. Then add on top of that, would I believe everything that I now knew? And, to my dismay, I was blaming my wife for what I was now doing.

What some others here helped me to understand is that my relentless digging was keeping the distant past alive. The truth of the matter is that the truth of the past is no longer the truth of the moment I live in now. But, as I stated earlier, I don’t think my thoughts and struggles that I deal with these days are helpful to those, like yourself, who are in the shorter shadow cast by their more current D-day.

Asterisk

I am in the midst of this battle right now.

There are very few of us "found out years later" folk on this sight. Thank you for your insight.

Trumansworld,

I am in the midst of this battle right now.

There are very few of us "found out years later" folk on this sight.

There are clear similarities in our storyline. You’ve said you were 16 when you and your husband met. My wife was 17, I was 18. You also stated that you have been together for nearly 50 years (married about 24ish?). My wife and I have 53 + years not including the year we dated. So again, similar. I think I am about 10 years older than you, but, at our age, that’s close enough for government work.

However, we differ in how long we have been dealing with the effects of D-day. If I understand it correctly, you discovered it approximately 3 years ago. In my case, it was 34 years ago. Though our timelines begin years apart they do merge by our similar age and longevity of our relationships. One can’t help to recognize that the path forward is dwarfed by the years gone by. That detail alone puts a whole different layer into the equation, especially about the benefits and drawbacks of reconciliation vs divorce.

I think it is important for me to stress that the time difference of our mutual dreaded journey may make some of the things I say unhelpful, maybe even hurtful. There is nothing more I dread than that my process might be injurious to anyone, especially to betrayeds and waywards. There is enough pain and unhealed wounds as it is.

I am very sorry you (and your husband) are having to trudge this trail of tears. No one should. I am sure you will find a great deal of wisdom here at SI.
Asterisk

I think that often the betrayed gets a watered down version of the affair(s). For some, that’s enough. For others, they need details and then some.

Case in point. The OW told me how my H had a business trip but returned a few days early to spend those days (and nights) w/ her. I’m sure he wasn’t going to admit to that as I wasn’t asking for the days and times they met in person.

However I’m glad I was told. That detail changed things for me and recognized the depths my H would go to have an affair.

Details are important or pain shopping, depending what you need them for.
While you are very hurt, it is possibly pain shopping, because you cannot grasp the essence of the details, the one behind them, and you only focus on the sordid things, the lies, the brutality.

But when you can see the "meaning" then it is helpful. If you are willing to reconcile with the person, knowing just how much, how low they could get, is almost critical. it is merciless to you.

You need to see them naked at their worst, just how much they can throw their dignity (and yours) because that is the thing that can give you an estimation of just the magnitude of work (and risk) you are taking in charge when opening to reconciling.
Knowing that about your husband gave you clarity, not just pain.

Every watered down version, every rewriting of the narrative, is just marketing, lying and painting themselves better than they proved they could be. It is a sales pitch and we have been already scammed before.
The details ar elike the fine print in a contract with the person who already cheated you out of everything emotional you had.

It might be a painful read, but you better made sure you read all the small writings this time before signing up.

Then there is the setting of boundaries. Yes, boundaries are extremely important in all relationships. But every boundary is a wall. Do I make it solid, unenterable, or do I build windows and doors into it? That is not co-dependent. It is chosen vulnerability.

I offer you a different view of boundaries:

They aren't walls like those of detachment or the barbed wire barriers of the wastelands of dissociation.

They are doors to your inner world. They must be weel guarded and the visitors vetted, but they are not closed, they are left open for those who deserve in.