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Initially, H said he only had sex a few times with the AP... then during the most recent disclosure (trickle truths) it appears they screwed like rabbits. I asked every question I could during this last disclosure and now feel gutted. I knew in my heart to try to avoid this path, but at the end of the day, I felt the innate need to know when, how (positions) and where. For those that have received this level of intimate detail, how have you processed and moved on? I'm so disgusted with H that I can't even feign hugging. I feel like I went pain shopping and am now trying to figure out what to do.

I was/am the same way. I think it's because you want to turn what was a secret, hidden thing into a shared event, and in that way it removes a layer of secrecy. Some people want to know the details and thats just how they process things. Also for me, if I didn't know the details, Id be filling them in myself with the worst possible versions and I wouldn't be able to stop thinking did they do this, did they do that. Knowing at least removes those unknowns.

I wanted all the little secrets out- the secrecy and "specialness" was half the thing in the A. By exposing it for the sordid, soulless nastiness it was, it really takes the shine off. I also felt that I needed to know what I might be recovering or forgiving for… and that meant knowing it all.
And I knew that as hard as it was, learning more later would be even worse.

Pain shopping or truth seeking?

This is good stuff for IC, and some have had good luck with EMDR for mind movies.

How is he behaving and helping you?

I'm so sorry details of the A are a kicker. They stay with you. I am not in R but I saw a lot of details in the texts that gutted me. They don't always carry the same gut punch as the initial time you learn of it, but disgusting nonetheless. Therapy helps with processing these details although they will never leave the mind completely. I hope your WS is doing the heavy lifting to help you get through this.

I never got details. But, I was motivated to try to get them as I thought by admitting to things, my XW might just feel some shame. I had no interest in graphic stuff. Just wanted names, dates, and which lies she told to orchestrate going out while I watched the kids.
Still, to this day 28 years later, no disclosure.

I actually got into my WH's email, so I saw verbal description, photos, and even video.
It's so traumatizing. That's why experts tend to agree that despite our natural urge to find out every jot, we're better off thinking it through and making an educated choice on what we want to know. I eventually learned to put my questions through the litmus test of "how does getting this answer help ME?" While there's something to be said for not allowing secrets to be kept between the cheater and the AP, the FACTS are that there existed intimacy between them and we can't change that. So, what we end up seeing later is that oftentimes people who felt they needed to know it all aren't any better off emotionally than those who put more thought into what they needed to know and in some cases, much worse.

At this point, I think it's wise to manage the trauma. EMDR (eye movement desensitization and reprocessing) can really help with that. If your therapist doesn't practice it, s/he can probably refer you to one who does. EMDR doesn't remove or cover up bad memories, but that visceral feeling, like stomach roiling or like you "can't even feign hugging" will fade.

Initially, H said he only had sex a few times with the AP... then during the most recent disclosure (trickle truths) it appears they screwed like rabbits. I asked every question -

Wanting to know - exposing their "secrets" - I wonder that everyone has the thought - but not all ask.

I didn't ask - if I wanted to "know" what two heterosexual people can do to/with each other - I could satisfy that isssue with some "porn-surfing." (barf!)

Watching two animals (four or two legs) just doesn't interest me and hearing the words describing same - just yuck. I put that right up there with cleaning up dirty diapers or the child's vomit caused by sickness. Wait - the last two items you do because that is "your job" as a family member. The details of copulation. Just no

I’m also in the want/ need to know camp, for same reasons already discussed:
* removing a layer of secrecy / shared events between WS and AP
* what I imagined was worse
* taking the shine off/ exposing sordid nature
* don’t think I’m capable of forgiving acts about which I’m not aware

I’m sure there are more, eg., there is a sense of knowledge being power, so I’d say it may have been a way to return some agency?

Like ChamTea, my IC had me ask questions with an eye toward "how does this information help me HEAL"?

For ME - and we are all different - it was tough to "process’, but once I did, it was fine (e.g., disclosing they did x sex act actually made it kind of disappear from my mind movies, and enabled me to engage in said sex act). I’d say I’d feel better in a few weeks tops after learning something (again, that’s ME). IME, the negative feelings (eg disgust) after learning of sexual deets did not last very long. I think I just decided to let myself feel all the feels (disgust, rage, self loathing, WS loathing, etc) and kind of got it out of my system.

It was the stuff I didn’t know that haunted me (and sometimes still does - even tho I’m not in R).

I do not agree with the perspective that the BS should not get any piece of info they desire -including the sexual deets. IMO, I’m a grown ass woman and I get to decide what i believe I can and cannot handle, so while i can see why some IC/MC/CSATs recommend not getting those deets, I would not be OK if they were to become some kind of gatekeeper of A-related info.

So, when asked, I usually recommend starting with something small (eg ONE act or ONE position and NO more) and seeing how a small bite feels.

I did not get any sexual deets other than those provided by my WH. So, I sometimes wonder if it makes any difference if the BS learns deets by discovering something on their own vs the WS proactively providing them… maybe there’s something to the idea that the WS’ willing truthfulness (and vulnerability therein) may be healing on its own? Just a thought.

I’m so sorry you are in the midst of this. It really does suck.

gmc94's list expressed my reasons very well.

* removing a layer of secrecy / shared events between WS and AP
* what I imagined was worse
* taking the shine off/ exposing sordid nature
* don’t think I’m capable of forgiving acts about which I’m not aware

But I got none of that when we originally R'd. Between my FWW making the process of getting answers torturous and a rug-sweeping therapist I was convinced to give up on getting answers from my FWW. I would parrot our therapist and say, "I know what grown-ups do in the bedroom."

But that was bullshit. I know what WE do in the bedroom. I know what porn stars do in bedroom. I don't know what THEY did in the bedroom.

I discovered enough from their communications to know that there were important differences that I could not understand. And because of the rug sweeping I would never be able to understand them.

So how do you move on when you can never know or understand what really happened? For me, I just had to accept the worst case. And the worst case was much worse than she has ever admitted. But that difference has haunted me in the bedroom for many years.

Only many years later after a trigger event did I realize that I was no longer willing to rug sweep it all. I was no longer willing to not know what was going on in my life for years. I was no longer willing to have those unexposed secrets and lies weighing on the intimacy of our relationship.

The delusion of openness and honesty was something that I always loved about our relationship before Dday. I tried to reclaim that once we started R by sharing with her the one big secret that I had never revealed (something from before we met). It got me nothing in return. I don't accept that any longer. These are secrets that she had no right to in the moment and no right to hang on to for almost 20 years.

Some of us are happy with not knowing everything, what we don't know won't hurt us, or we just don't want to know how far down the rabbit whole our WS went.. Some, like me, want to know everything so that we don't have to let our imaginations run riot with what ifs!!
The level of detail you want is ENTIRELY your call, it should NEVER be the WS call, not if they want to R.

I found out about my WW A from her phone.. So i saw messages, pictures, videos etc.. I saw her tell him quite explicitly why she chose him, what acts she wanted, and she was quite clear to him I was not capable of being that person in the bedroom with her. Regardless of what she has told me since then I do not believe her for a new York second that she is 100% happy in the bedroom now.. But at least i know exactly what went on between them.. It may stay with me forever, but to me at least i dont imagine the worst without knowing the truth..

It is entirely your call.. Don't EVER let them convince you otherwise, the only reason they have to not tell you what you want to hear is SHAME, shame they were caught, shame they are cheating on you, and shame when the light of day is upon their tawdry choices.

I did too and am over it. The guy had a bigger dick then me too. Yeah that hurt for awhile.

But guess what? That’s probably all the relationship was. I’m okay with it now bc I’m my case it was just sex.

I know that she didn’t actually love that guy and I am the one she loves. Oh and believe me when I tell you this: it’s a short course that fades with time.

You need to remember that it wasn’t so much the sex but the thrill of the entire thing. The build up, the newness of it and the illicit nature of it all. That’s why these things usually fade after awhile and affairs don’t become as exciting after a few months unless that person is in love with them.

Your value is not reliant on sex. Theirs is. What a shitty value for them to have compared to you.

Keep your head up bc you have enormous value. You need to look in the mirror and realize that. I promise that will help

Google on Curiosity Is Not Intrinsically Good and it should point to an article in Scientific American. Two quotes from it…

Why do people seek out information about an ex's new relationships, read negative Internet comments and do other things that will obviously be painful? Because humans have an inherent need to resolve uncertainty, according to a recent study in Psychological Science. The new research reveals that the need to know is so strong that people will seek to slake their curiosity even when it is clear the answer will hurt.

And

Morbid curiosity is possible to resist, however. In a final experiment, participants who were encouraged to predict how they would feel after viewing an unpleasant picture were less likely to choose to see such an image. These results suggest that imagining the outcome of following through on one's curiosity ahead of time can help determine whether it is worth the endeavor. "Thinking about long-term consequences is key to mitigating the possible negative effects of curiosity," Hsee says.

HouseOf - I appreciate that blurb. It makes a lot of sense to me. And I think it falls in line with the BS asking themselves ‘how will this help me heal?" Before embarking upon the truth digging.

I agree that we are ALL different. Some folks do not want to know, and I totally respect that (and TBH, sometimes feel a bit jealous!).

For ME, I do not regret any of the sexual deets that I know about. Indeed, a primary reason I’m not even considering R is that my WH won’t be honest about the nature & extent of his As (and that is not limited to sexual deets, but all of it), as FOR ME, his unwillingness to be forthcoming about it is tons more important than what the info he’s keeping actually IS.

RunningHelps - how are YOU doing? I know it’s REALLY rough to process through all those emotions, to try and stop the mind movies about what you know (and maybe what you may still imagine). It just sucks and feels so dark and lonely and (for me) angry and disgusting. It takes time to work through all of those feelings and it is NO picnic doing that work. It does get better. Sending strength.

a primary reason I’m not even considering R is that my WH won’t be honest about the nature & extent of his As

Yup, it is about who gets to control that flow of information. It has to be you that says ‘no’, not the WS. The only way to make sure it is you, is to ask.

If infidelity is a deal breaker, no details are necessary. Disclose the reasoning to your immediate family and file. If you brought this person into their life, you have a responsibility to disclose why you are now removing them from yours.

My experience was both the best and the worst. My WW kept very detailed journals that described more than I could ever want to know. I found an impossible discrepancy in one of our accounts and it lead me to violate the privacy of her journals. I will never know if this was the first PA in 30 years or the last. You must decide what are your deal breakers and work ruthlessly to get those details. At one time I thought infidelity might be pardonable. Now I know myself better, and I know my WW MUCH better.

A counterpoint to HoP's quotation:

My biggest concern was finding a deal killer after putting in 6 months, a year, 2 years of work on R. I wanted to get the bad news out as quickly as I could so that I could move on to a good life as quickly as I could. (I had given up on trying to control the outcome or my W's behavior. Healing myself was my highest priority; D or R would grow out of my healing and my W's actions.)

One of the side benefits of asking everything I could think of asking was that I found out the sex was not great. The first few sessions were great, but the A lasted a lot longer than that, and my W very much traded not-so-good sex for not-so-good ego kibbles. Oh - and very scary threats.

The sex part boggled my mind. I can't imagine cheating with anyone but a potential sex-goddess. I' d cheat only if the sex was going to be so good that my orgasm would vaporize me. (That way I wouldn't have to deal with the aftermath.... ) But my W's answers to my pretty sophisticated questioning was always very sordid sex, without any great Tantric payoff.

Another side effect was my W's answers helped me read her tells. Another - more important - was that her honest answers told me she was taking responsibility for herself.

So I'm in favor of asking everything despite the risks. But that's only one way of handling the problem. We all have to choose what questions to ask.

Running, You think you may have made less than the best choice for you. If you did, have faith in yourself to recover.

My BH wanted details and I provided them in excruciating detail. His reasons were the same as other have said. He needed to know what he was dealing with to heal and to decide on his future. He was imagining the worst and I proved him right. That’s was extremely hard for him to recover from, knowing what I did, how often and all the specifics. We’ve talked about whether he regrets asking and his answer has pretty much been no. He was in a lot of pain hearing it all, but he was happy he asked. He was going to have mind movies either way. At least this way it was based on reality and not his imagination.

He also said something similar to Sisoon. Having me tell him was a test of sorts for me. Would I be honest or try and minimize it to "spare him" (read: spare me). Would I put him first and do what he asked because he felt he needed to know even though every part of me was screaming that I shouldn’t? I wanted my BH and my M and I knew, I just knew, that giving him all the details would destroy him and our M (even though I already destroyed it through my A). What would I do? That was my test. Hearing the details was the price he paid for that answer.

Another thing he mentioned about why he asked me for details was that knowledge is power. He wanted his power back after me stealing it from him by having an A behind his back. By having everything in the open, he was able to gain some semblance of control. I didn’t have anything that was secret anymore. It was out there.

Was it good, healthy, helpful? I don’t know. But it’s what he wanted. IMO there are no right answers. Either way the recovery period is hard and takes time. I agree with everyone who recommended therapy. Please get help from someone who can guide you through this.

Running,

At least you know where you stand, and you have the facts, hopefully as they are.

Any forgiveness you gave your H before was stolen by him fraudulently, he should have volunteered without your asking.

So many never get an honest account of the affair, I doubt my W will ever come clean.