SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

Hello SI,

I am a long-time lurker, first-time poster here. Since I have been divorced for 4 years now, I thought I'd post my question here, but please let me know in case it should go somewhere else.

Short background info: I am 37 now. I was in a happy relationship with who I thought was my best friend from 22 to 32 (5 years dating, 5 married). Then I basically watched him fall in love for a mutual friend for the last three months of our relationship. I asked him to take a step back because I was uncomfortable with the intensity of the friendship they shared, ony to be told I am controlling and she is just a friend and he should be able to have friends yadda yadda. Three months after a lot of back and forth he one day left me (for her, although he never explicitly mentioned this). I was still blindsided as he had been telling me that all the problems were in my head, and I was trying to rein jealousy in. I told him there was nothing left to talk about, and I wanted a divorce. He agreed.

I am not completely over it, I wouldn't be here otherwise. But I can't seem to regain my sense of trust. I have been dating another person until recently. We dated for 2.5 years, but in the last six months he met another woman who honestly seems like tailor-made for him. All the same interests, a great, deep, immediate connection. While I felt uneasy about it as soon as I met her, I waited to see how he would behave. But they are going down the full best-friend route, talking a lot, doing plenty of things together and setting up joint projects, as their hobbies overlap a lot with what they want out of their careers. My career is completely unrelated and, while I share some of their interests as a hobby, I could never devote as much time to them as they do. So last week I left him, and I told him the truth. He has now a new best friend, he's better friends with her than he is with me, and while I am sure it's not sexual, I just can't stand there and watch this go further. I caught him completely by surprise and he was devastated. I wasn't happy myself, but I caught myself wanting to police him and so I decided I was not going ask that he take a step back as I did with my ex. But I was also not going to watch. While he doesn't think he's best friends with her, he did agree breaking up was the best way forward. If my ex-husband had been an asshole... but he wasn't until the very end. So now even if I have a good relationship, if I see this best-friend sort of thing going on, I will bow out rather than bring it up.

While I haven't exactly regretted my decision, I can't stop thinking she IS a friend, and while I wasn't comfortable, he did not actually change any of his behaviour towards me (although he will not attend certain events, related to their career development if she doesn't go, for example). I can't stop hearing my ex's voice in my head "You are too controlling. You are an abuser. I am allowed to have friends".

But for me, I want to think about my life partner as my best friend, and I want them to feel the same way about me. I am not opposed to having friends of the opposite sex per se, but there just seems to be some kind of invisible, blurry, subjective line where it becomes too intense. So when I saw myself telling my partner in my head "So why are you talking to her when you told me two hours ago you wanted to go to sleep" (he sent a screenshot of their convo) I began to seriously consider breaking up. And then when two days later he mentioned he wanted to ask her to set up a business with him, it was over. I knew I would suffer watching how they do all the things they love so much together.

But today I told a friend and he said "So you are, in fact, controlling". And I guess that's what's brought me here. The past few days I have been alternating between feeling guilty, feeling that my ex husband was right after all, and that I am doing the right thing.

I am looking for insight. What am I missing here? What are my blind spots? Am I overdoing boundaries? I understand that trust is trust and that I have lost it, but any pointers on how to regain it? Any recs (books, articles, films) that have helped you? Any thoughts on how to approach this?

Thanks a lot in advance if you have read this far. I hope it's not too all over the place.

But today I told a friend and he said "So you are, in fact, controlling".

Sounds like the Bro Code kicked in there. A true friend would never actually say anything like that. (You need better friends.)

There's nothing wrong with taking steps to protect yourself from a repeat hurt.

"Not Just Friends" is a good reference. A true partner worthy of you would never behave this way. You are the prize!

Bullet dodged. NEXT.

FGP,

Your question seems tailor made for New Beginnings and I'm looking forward to reading the responses.

I feel like you handled both situations well and not sure what would be considered controlling in your behavior. When your partner becomes close with the opposite sex, IMO, there must be discussion and possibly confrontation. Like many on SI, I have learned the lesson in not ignoring the red flags. Your boundary doesn't seem unreasonable, as I read it, you won't tolerate a partner who allows themselves to be too close to another woman?

But for me, I want to think about my life partner as my best friend, and I want them to feel the same way about me.

Yes. For some this isn't what they want out of a relationship, but you do. This may go to compatibility. You thought you had this both times. You had someone take that away in the 1st case and you were clear-eyed in seeing the sea of red flags the 2nd time around. Maybe it's examining mate choice? That's on my agenda for things to work through, how I've selected partners in the past and how I go about it now.

But for me, I want to think about my life partner as my best friend, and I want them to feel the same way about me. I am not opposed to having friends of the opposite sex per se, but there just seems to be some kind of invisible, blurry, subjective line where it becomes too intense.

Is it really that blurry? The reality is many of the activities these "friendships" involve shouldn't be engaged in by a committed partner. We regulate our behavior and we ask intimate partners for the same regulation. Avoiding intimacy with the opposite sex is necessary behavior in a committed relationship. I'm not sure where my new boundaries will be for these behaviors, but your description of events won't be within my tolerance.

We are a product of our experiences. Your ex-BF was on the slippery slope. He may have not have slide all the way down the slope like your Ex-husband, but from what you describe he was well on his way. FWIW too much similarities between partners is just as bad as not enough, so I don't think that was the root cause. It's incredibly sad that your BF didn't catch that he made you feel second to his new friend. If it hadn't been for your ex-husband behavior and gaslighting of you, you may have been able to work through it. Your experiences combined with the lack on his part, means he wasn't the one for you.

But today I told a friend and he said "So you are, in fact, controlling". And I guess that's what's brought me here.

Your friend is an asshole. It's not controlling to act on how someone makes you feel. You didn't try to control your ex. You just removed yourself from the equation.

I think you have handled yourself extremely well. With the H you saw where it was and knew what you were facing (a full blown affair). With the BF you had the experience behind to know what you were facing (an affair).

The BF had one discrepancy that showed you he was lying. And I think based on experience you were spit on.

Controlling? Hell no! Intuitive? Hell Yes!

And your friend — not as smart as you that’s for sure.

I’m certain by now the XBF and his "pal" are in the throes of a relationship. After all with you out of the way (so to speak) he’s free to do what he wants.

First of all, thank you so much FaithFool, ANewPerson, grubs and The1stWife for reading and for your insights on this. I hope I can answer you all correctly formatting-wise. I haven't been able to figure out a way to respond to each message so I hope one message in response to you all will be okay. I also hope some more people will contribute with their experience/recs.

"Not Just Friends" is a good reference. A true partner worthy of you would never behave this way.

FaithFool, I just read it last week! Truth be told, I only read the part where they describe how an affair happens even in good relationships. I didn't read the whole reconciliation section, as it honestly still feels like a slap in the face (not that I ever even tried, but also not that there was anything to work with). But it felt very validating to read that the narrative that it only happens in relationships where there are problems is quite skewed.

This may go to compatibility.

Maybe it's examining mate choice?

ANewPerson, I think with my now exBF it really is a compatibility issue. He does seem to think that a relationship should just go smoothly on its own, without ever talking about it. Then when I left him he asked to talk as he wa hurting so much and then told me "Sometimes I didn't know if we were okay" to which I replied "I asked you explicitly dozens of times and you always said we were fine". Apparently me talking about problems made him feel I am some kind of sniper, waiting to "trap" him somehow. But somehow he still thinks this makes for a happy relationship. Of course, had he told me, I would have broken up with him much sooner. I can almost hear it in my mind now, "Well, not that we were ever that happy to begin with!". This made me angry, but also helped me feel like I was right on the money.

As for examining mate choice, honestly, I wish I knew how to do that! I've been in therapy for forever and they do not seem to be able to pinpoint problems with that. I actively and explicitly look for people who treat me well, and who treat others well, who seem capable of taking care of themselves (this did change after I was married, but I didn't know this was a red flag back then), and who seem on a similar level to me both politically and intellectually. I have no problem saying no to men I do not like as romantic partners and I do not have trouble leaving if it comes to that. I am really not sure what I might be doing wrong. Any pointers on this are also welcome!

Avoiding intimacy with the opposite sex is necessary behavior in a committed relationship.

A friend of mine put this beautifully when I told her how I was feeling about this break-up. She said "Look, I spend a lot of time with you and my other friends. Still, it is nowhere near to the time I spend with my partner. It would be weird of me to now go and spend more time with a male friend than I do with any of you." She has plenty of male friends and acquaintances, so she has a very good point. However, my exBF hadn't quite reached that point yet.

Your ex-BF was on the slippery slope.

grubs - Oh yes. Sometimes quite literally. They go hiking But jokes aside, this is exactly the way I feel about it.

You didn't try to control your ex. You just removed yourself from the equation.

This is exactly what I said in response to my friend. "I am not sure how controlling I am in practice, given that I'd rather remove myself completely than ask anything at all from him". He didn't really have an answer to that.

After all with you out of the way (so to speak) he’s free to do what he wants.

The1stWife, this also feels taken straight out of my mind. It makes me incredibly sad. He did say thank you, and that I was being very generous by leaving rather than asking him to curb it, which he also was honest that he wasn't willing to do.

Thanks everyone so much for your input. I am feeling a bit better with all your support. Also because sometimes I forget that while ExH (sadly) convinced me of how controlling I am, I still had to help him get out all the stuff that he inexplicably left here when he discarded me, and about a year later he moved into my same street. Because I would move right next to my controlling ex-partner. Sheesh.

But as I said at the beginning, I am still on the lookout for more experiences/recs. Please feel free to share!

Sounds like you handled the situation well. Your hard work in IC has definitely given you dividends. Partner choice is a tough one. I mean, we really cannot know a person until enough time has passed for us to measure their character. The difficult part is that we become emotionally invested over that time, clouding our judgment to a degree.

I am dating a woman now and although we are not totally compatible on every level, we are on the ones that count. My experiences with the trauma of infidelity has given me a clearer perspective on what I want and need in a partner. Have I made a mistake in choosing her? Time will tell, and if so, there will be some emotional pain, but I am strong and secure enough to weather the storm.

Like I said earlier, you have done the work and are now possess the social-emotional tools to evaluate things objectively. Maybe you need a partner who has also achieved this level of self-awareness.

Thank you for your input as well. This in particular resonated with me:

I mean, we really cannot know a person until enough time has passed for us to measure their character. The difficult part is that we become emotionally invested over that time, clouding our judgment to a degree.

Such a good summary.

I guess that there is a certain threshold of friendship that I am simply not cool with, both in terms of intimacy and in terms of frequency (meaning some degree of intimacy between friends is to be expected, but when this becomes daily or almost daily, I struggle with it). I guess this also puts me in the "not cool" list, but I think I am fine with that.

I have been going over this belief that I am controlling again. It was completely created by my ex-husband when he needed it, so for eight years I wasn't controlling, but then one day I had become an abuser because I asked him to take a step back. I tend to forget this is the cheater's playbook. I did trust my ex husband so much, I even believed him when he said it.

As for my ex-BF, well, while we were together I travelled twice abroad on my own to see friends, and he did once as well. We only saw each other on the weekends. I never had a problem until he met this particular person, and then I waited to see how it would develop. I am not sure why I am still struggling so much to remember it is not true.

I have been going over this belief that I am controlling again. It was completely created by my ex-husband when he needed it, so for eight years I wasn't controlling, but then one day I had become an abuser because I asked him to take a step back. I tend to forget this is the cheater's playbook.

Yup, it’s deflection. Make YOU seem like the one who has issues to take the heat off themselves.

"I am not sure how controlling I am in practice, given that I'd rather remove myself completely than ask anything at all from him". He didn't really have an answer to that.

Methinks your friend doesn’t really know the term as well as he thinks he does.

I’m sure those on the outside would see it as controlling, but you’re really just setting boundaries. If they’re not ok with those boundaries, then they’re not someone you should be with. This goes for iffy friendships as well

Summed up, I personally don’t think you’re doing anything wrong. You’re only changing what YOU can change. You decide to bow out of a shady situation instead of asking those around you to change. That’s far from controlling and quite the opposite of what that ‘friend’ of yours claims

Those who are truly worth your trust won’t feel the need to make you feel bad for being cautious

[This message edited by Forks027 at 12:00 AM, Wednesday, November 22nd]