SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

I appreciate everyone’s grace. Especially my husbands!!! I am glad that before figuring this out I had softened towards him. We were on an trip over the weekend visiting the grandbabies and watching him with them had me in my feels.

He wasn’t even mad, just relieved and he said he knows he would have felt the same way in reverse, so he made my crow eating as easy as you all did.

It’s weird but in some ways it now feels like when you have a vivid dream about your spouse and then wake up mad at them? Like I am having to remind myself it was just a dream sort of thing.

So maybe I'll just ask you: given this experience and your epiphanies earlier in the thread, how are you thinking about your pact?

Hmmm. I don’t know if I am in a place that I believe a blind pardon is wise. I am willing to say that I do believe people change and have a willingness to look at something as this is not who we are today. In that way I think I would do well with most anything.

I am still of the mindset that I don’t want to be married to a liar. That I am willing to offer the things that are also important than I get.

So, whether there is a pact or no pact, I still have very high expectations on honesty and I do reserve the right to decide based on what gets thrown at me regardless of when it happened.

But I am also very willing to live under that same set of rules. I simply do not find a good reason for dishonesty. I won’t divorce or be mad about a technicality. But I believed he lied about another woman/relationship and kept the lie. I don’t think that is an over reaction based on the importance of this area to me. And I think after infidelity a lie about another woman still speaks to the same vein of an affair.

What I have learned as a ws is that respect is not represented by just not making someone upset. I think I used that form of respect in many ways through our marriage. Respect is believing the other person is worthy of our consideration and honesty is fundamental to that. Also when you respect yourself, you are able give it to the same degree towards others.

I think the "pact" really is just a representation of my values. I do not really ask for a lot in our relationship. His desk is always gonna be messy, I am going to be picking up his underwear until the day I die. He is always going to forget our plans even if I tell him 20 times. And he will always be cranky when I want to stay somewhere longer than he does. But I just don’t want to be lied to, even if the truth is hurtful to me.

I'm happy this story ended up like this. I would have been deeply sad for you if you would have been thrown back into long term chaos.

Well obviously me too. I do think there have been some questions that I should still monitor within myself through this. But the whole reason for this whole post thread is I am unwilling to be placed back in long term chaos. I have shared that I will not go through R agin with anyone, I do not feel differently. I just couldn’t tell yet if this was going to be that. I would 100 percent rather be alone than wait out another round of “can he get it right?”

He says he feels the same.

I will add this doesn’t seem hard to us. Like it’s not an unwanted vigilance or a burdensome one.

What it actually is - knowing what we want and deserve in a relationship and honoring ourselves in making sure we get those things. Whether that’s under the guise of a pact or a marriage or whatever construct man comes up with that spell’s security to one’s mind, then I am not sure I learned what you wonder if I have learned? Moreso I am just reminded that you can feel security without having a useless guarantee of it? And that’s more about living day by day I suppose.

[This message edited by hikingout at 4:41 PM, Thursday, October 17th]

I still have very high expectations on honesty....

I think you have reasonable expectations. At least I hope so, since I expect both W and me to not lie ever, after about 7:45 AM CST on 12/22/2010.

I also think there's more going on here than questioning your H's honesty. I think the crux has been your faith in yourself to ... IDK exactly how to word it ... trust yourself.

In any case, I'm glad you got the facts. And remember: sometimes the forgiveness you extend has to be extended toward yourself. But you know that....

*****

T/J, sort of -

Another lesson, similar to hiking's -

When I was 13-14 months out, my W casually mentioned a time she ate dinner with ow, obs, and their kid at their home, after which she and ow adjourned to the M bedroom for heavy petting. I was horrified for obs. This was TT of the worst sort! W was shocked at my reaction. She said it was on her timeline, and she was right. When she did the TL, though, I was horrified at the aspect of the child being there. There's a big difference between seeing an old revelation in a different light and TT.

For those who haven't done a TL, the more you write down, the better.

End T/J

I think the crux has been your faith in yourself to ... IDK exactly how to word it ... trust yourself.

Yes this unearthed some new questions so I am a believer we are shown what lessons we need to learn or what we need to examine, all we have to do is be awake or aware of it.

And thank you for sharing your story of a time this happened to you. I really have no idea how I forgot about this, but at the time there was so much going on it was the least of my concerns at the time.

I also think there's more going on here than questioning your H's honesty. I think the crux has been your faith in yourself to ... IDK exactly how to word it ... trust yourself.

I hope I’m not coming off as preachy. Sisoon’s comment here helped me reframe what I’m thinking on this storyline. Sadly it’s going to have me taking aim yet again at a "sacred cow" that I perceive at SI.

"Trust yourself" : I can lean into that 99.2%

"Trust your gut" : that is never going to be my mantra. Now I totally see the value of it when you are being lied to and gaslit. In that case where someone is actively deceiving you, I think a person should default to listening to themselves because other narrators are unreliable. But (I like to think) most of the time we aren’t being actively deceived in life. And life is complicated. Using our "gut" is one source of input we should take into consideration as we make choices. But my understanding of what my gut is is 100% separate from my rational brain, and I just so happen to like to use that too (ETA: and I know you do too). An active deceiver makes trying to use normal rules of rationality impossible, the well is being poisoned. But once you are out of that insanity, then part of trusting yourself I think includes far more than gut. It includes trusting your rational thinking as well.

I think it makes sense that you are wary of what category you are in. I’m very happy for you this added evidence towards his honesty.

[This message edited by InkHulk at 9:01 PM, Thursday, October 17th]

Thanks ink.

It boils down to a couple things that came up in this thread that I want to think about more deeply.

The number one thing that came about is thinking about what bsr said about his compartmentalization skills being different than mine. This is indisputable. It’s not new to me but it hit me different in her post.

The second thing that came up was I just so eager to self punish and make amends have I put my head in the sand? I don’t blame the relationship for the affair but I do think I blame the relationship for feeling so done with the marriage because that really was there prior to the affair crazies. (But keep in mind I know I was one half of said relationship and I am not without my own accountability)

I am taking this more with a grain of salt considering I have found no lies and this whole thing was breakdown over a lost memory.

Also, the person who hustled to make the amends and self punish has still found herself in a much better and more fulfilling relationship.

I don’t operate on just gut or mind either, I use them in unison. I am gonna let the smoke clear from this, because I was deeply in a trajectory that no longer makes sense. I feel like I will likely begin trusting my reality just fine again, but I also believe everything happens for a reason and if spirit is nudging me on something I won’t disregard it out of hand.

[This message edited by hikingout at 8:54 PM, Thursday, October 17th]

That’s a pretty strong example of the benefits of truth-telling in reconciliation.

I’m happy for you both. Do something nice together.

Do something nice together.

A fine idea, I second that.