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Vulnerable post for me, gentle feedback is appreciated.

Many years ago, "DDay 1" I experienced what I now know is called hysterical bonding. It was all on the more "mild" level. The texts I found were overly flirtatious and kept secret, it had already ended, WH apologized and we moved on (classic rug sweeping). I had a mild hysterical bonding reaction which lasted a few weeks to a month maybe.

Fast forward to DD#2, 8/2023, found out a couple of different situations with a couple of different people not as "innocent". I was BOUND and DETERMINED to avoid hysterical bonding because I feel that personally for me it leads to rug sweeping. I definitely had a doozy episode of hysterical bonding but I did NOT act on it with WH, I just managed my own needs

Well, over a year later I think I'm still having episodes of reactivity. I'm wondering if I was just delaying a step, almost denying a necessary part of the process?? We have been intimate a few times, out of my sexual frustration leading to me initiating. What I'm noticing is when we talk about the infidelity, opening up about our sexual needs, etc. it triggers a reactive episode. For example, we discussed a podcast we listened to (Tammy Nelson, open monogamy related) and this activated what I now see as an episode. Many months ago I found a fantasy story he had written which also activated an episode. So all this time has passed, we have opened up, and been vulnerable about sexual needs, and now I feel the desire fading again. So now I'm thinking what if all this intimacy progression was just hysterical bonding?

Has anyone experienced this? How can you differentiate hysterical bonding from true intimacy?

I don’t think you do.

I think all of us (most especially women) have an ebb and flow of desire. There is a lot that feeds into that Both internally and externally.

I get that in an emotionally unsafe relationship that you do not want to reward behaviors. Nor do you want to give the other person false hope. Sex can be very bonding, and of course you do not want to bond with someone that you don’t like and don’t want to be with.

But this is even more grey, isn’t it? You do not know what you want to do about the relationship at all a lot of the time. And that is normal. I think you could expect to be up nd down a bit with desire.

I can share that I had a lot of trouble with sex after my husbands affair. For one, we were in the same house so I would have mind movies of them together. But also because he once got his iPad out in the middle of me doing something to him and he put it on his stomach, blocking our view of each other. We didn’t have sex for like three months after that, and that is a record by like a lot.

But when we did resume sex/intimacy it actually helped us move forward together. The bonding was very important. It also helped me heal, human touch is a powerful need. I don’t know where you are in your journey, I am only commenting because your post does sound a little like you are overthinking it a little.

I think too after infidelity people do a lot of talking and trying to reconnect. Perhaps adding more vulnerability to keep that communication open would warm things back up? i think as the dust settles and things get back to normal we can fall back into talking less and kind of getting caught up in day to day life.

[This message edited by hikingout at 7:47 PM, Wednesday, October 23rd]

I definitely had a doozy episode of hysterical bonding but I did NOT act on it with WH

I'm not so sure that what you're describing is HB, simply because you didn't include your H. IMO, HB has an element of codependency.

From an article I found:

Let’s look into the various signs of the phenomenon of hysterical bonding... Here are the signs:

You may find yourself ruminating about the specifics of the sexual infidelity encounter(s).
Strong feelings of self-doubt may be experienced by the one who has been cheated on.
You may feel this deep urge to forgive your partner no matter what they do, just so that they’ll stick around.
You strongly wish to do whatever it takes to win your beloved back.
Strong feelings of desperation.
You may feel a need to satisfy your partner sexually.
You resort to sexual experimentation to win back your partner.
You feel that your sex life has improved significantly.
You find yourself initiating sex more often. Greater assertiveness in the bedroom.
You keep thinking about the infidelity incident(s) constantly, no matter what.

HB lasted a long time for me, like almost a year, and a big factor was the need to feel connected to my H in a sexual way. I needed to be better than. Better than we had been, and better than what he had with her. There was competition going on in my head, for sure. I also loved feeling so powerful and sexy and desired.

Maybe you're just randy from lack of sex?

SacredSoul33
All the following resonate;

Strong feelings of self-doubt may be experienced by the one who has been cheated on.
Strong feelings of desperation.
You may feel a need to satisfy your partner sexually.
You resort to sexual experimentation to win back your partner.
You feel that your sex life has improved significantly.
You find yourself initiating sex more often. Greater assertiveness in the bedroom.

Randy? Perhaps but until DDay I was RARELY in the mood. I had emotionally disconnected long before (which I see now).

Hikingout
Correct on the overthinking to a degree. However, I'm also trying to pay close attention to my nervous system on the whole and lead with authenticity to discover what I need/want. Difficult balance for sure.
Ugh, that experience sounds very difficult and traumatizing for sure So sorry.

I can tell the sex is very bonding for him. I'm not feeling the same way on the whole. I'm wondering if it was ever bonding for me, insert overthinking here. There has been a lot of communication and some warming up on my end, and tons on his. Perhaps it's just more time or perhaps I'm too scared to let go.

I suppose I got stuck on what you said about managing your own needs and thought that's what you were still doing. I'm rereading now and understanding that you weren't having sex with him a year ago, right after DDay when the HB urge was strong, but are sometimes sleeping with him now. Okay, I get it.

Perhaps but until DDay I was RARELY in the mood. I had emotionally disconnected long before (which I see now).

Same. It seems like every life-changing negative thing that happened to me within our marriage was related to sex. Unplanned pregnancy which led to emotional abandonment which led to me disconnecting. Affairs and all that that entails. It's a lot to overcome to get back to a healthy sex life.

I'm also trying to pay close attention to my nervous system on the whole and lead with authenticity to discover what I need/want.

I agree that you might be overthinking it a bit. Based on your other posts, you like to do deep dives on everything, and I get that. I'm like that. From one "WHY?" girl to another, maybe you're navel-gazing a bit too much and need more practice being in the moment. It doesn't all have to MEAN something. Does that make sense?

thank SacredSoul. Guilty as charged with overthinking.

Totally get it. In fact let me give you some things to overthink more about. Haha

So sex for me wasn’t about bonding for a lonnnnngg time.

I don’t think we had deep emotional intimacy before and in our pre A marriage there wasn’t even much kissing involved in it. I am not sure how or why- my husband I believe had porn issues (I am just starting to acknowledge that in the last year or so- I always kind of rugswept that aspect) so our sex life was…fucking is the best way to put it?

Now he has backed off the porn a good deal (he is the one who recognized it was a problem and dealt with it without my asking) and now sex is often more slow or passionate and more about enjoying being together, it’s a lot more intimate.

We did have the hyper bonding after my affair and I think it was about like soul sister said - -a year or more of that. But I agree it was more a codependency situation.

What I was trying to get across is our desire as females (though I can’t speak for males) is much more complex so it’s hard to say sometimes in the throws of it whether it’s hyper bonding or what is causing the uptick. But even in a normal marriage I effected by betrayal there are often periods were sex is kind of just part of things and periods where you are really into each other or maybe even just feeling good about yourself or feeling the sexual need more after some dormancy.

So I don’t think you can diagnose it.

But I do think you should pay attention to your nervous system and how you are feeling. I think for a lot of men it’s naturally bonding and makes them feel close, but a lot of us women need to feel close before sex can happen.

I think the sex part, as long as you don’t feel you are damaging yourself- let go. I think it’s natural not to want to. But it really can be good for you in many ways as long as you are feeling safer in the relationship than you were. I would maybe focus more on that and what you need for connection rather than trying to classify it as hyper bonding or so on and so forth. I think those things are easier to see in hindsight when things have changed?

[This message edited by hikingout at 8:23 PM, Thursday, October 24th]

Thank you Hikingout, spot on with pre-A sex, excellent points to consider. The vast majority of our sexual relationship has been obligatory/chore/me emotionally regulating him (higher desire). Albeit it was always a good experience for me as well, the initiation part was rarely if ever by me, for many reasons. So I realize there is a whole part of me that I've never really attended to and discovering what makes me feel close or drawn to someone to initiate intimacy. So far I'm still unsure of that formula but I'd like to work on that and I do feel safe with him so no time like the present.

Hopefully, that makes sense.

Oh I am not good at initiating either. Always pretty receptive and also a good experience for me usually but in our post A marriage I have made more of an effort. I also learned to ask for him to initiate differently, that took some time for me to figure out. Because sometimes the way he initiated was a big turn off that then I had to work to overcome.

This is an actually good work that you are doing. It took a long time to build that area and the efforts were well worth it. We have gone from good /great to amazing, and I have to say that a lot of that was about me being less passive in what I wanted. But it was awkward at first to figure out what that even was. I understand what you are saying completely- and I will say maybe it’s not overthinking, but being more mindful that has you thinking these things.

Building something new is what this is all about.

I will add one last thing- I have read that women are more a responsive desire rather than the driving one. That is actually normal. But I have found getting more comfortable with initiating can begin to feel sexy and powerful too. Do what feels right to you, and keep holding the questions so you can hear your body’s answers.

[This message edited by hikingout at 6:19 PM, Friday, October 25th]